Rosa Arriaga on transferrable discipline toolkits, making a difference, & caring for the grad student journey

Rosa Arriaga is a developmental psychologist who transitioned into computer science as a senior research scientist in the School of Interactive Computing at Georgia Tech in the US. She talks about the journey becoming a computer scientist and applying the toolkit she brings from her psychology background to technology problems around chronic disease management and the reward of seeing real impact in people’s lives. She has also recently taken on the role of Chair of Graduate Affairs and talks with passion about her role in making processes and expectations clear and easy, and in promoting the importance of whole selves.

We don’t know what we are going to prepare our students for. We can’t even imagine. So what we need to do is train them on a toolkit that they’re going to be able to problems we can’t even imagine.

I have a toolkit, I have a way of understanding the world. And then I apply this toolkit to these (CS) problems (that) are very different to what I would have encountered as a psychologist

It is a powerful thing to feel like you could change the world, could make things better. And if that’s what you can do it is worth it.

Those who can do, and those who care become administrators

It’s not failure, it’s feedback. How do we give you the feedback that you are doing well or that this is not the right place for you and that is fine too.

Overview (times approximate): [You can also download a full transcript here]

01:40 Becoming a computer scientist from a PhD in developmental psychology and the transferrable toolkit

09:44 How she applies her toolkit to computer science problems

19:00 More on finding her way into computer science

32:40 Being in a research faculty rather than an academic faculty position

38:10 Her role as chair of graduate affairs

In more detail, she talks about…

01:40 How someone with a PhD in developmental psychology ended up in a computer science department? Related to a question of quality of life for the family, her husband, a theoretical computer scientist, getting a job offer at Georgia Tech (GT) and GT putting out a call for who could use a psychologist. Gregory Abowd responded as doing work with autism. He’s been a friend and mentor since 2006.

04:48 Her favourite quote from Pasteur - “Chance favours the prepared mind”. The kind of training she received taught her how to think. And we don’t know what we are going to prepare our students for so need to train them on a toolkit.

05:45 The thinking initially was that she would be there for a while and she would decide what she would do in 3 years and then go to a different uni where she felt more at home. But in those 3 years she came to appreciate HCI, doing the same things, just using a different lexicon.

06:45 Her worldview is still very post-positivist and has also learnt to appreciate all the other approaches that her colleagues bring, when you are trying to answer back to that toolkit to solve problems. Talks about the differences between psychology and computer science, in approaches, publishing and speed. She brings her strengths as a psychologist to a different set of problems. And one of the things she brings to CS is her desire to have these systems work in the real world for extended periods of time. Not as if she came from an applied background. But when you get to CS and see the power to have, “I see the applied work really calls to me”

09:44 Playing out a post-positivist approach in fieldwork? Mentions a replication study on text messaging improving lung function. Her interest is in why. Why did it work? And will it scale? And looking for the underlying theory. And if it works for asthma, will it work for other conditions? So ran the study again. Then looks at scaling the program so others can run these studies. Technology that can be transformative for other fields.

11:30 What is CS about this? Why not health psychology? Health psychology won’t develop systems or think about scale. Whereas HCI is about the human, the user, providing toolkits to other domains. Finding what technology will help them do their job. How to make the technology better. It’s about the interfaces, being useful and usable.

13:30 Did she think this way in the beginning or has it been a journey? Has been a journey. A way of understanding. Learning what the right way is to talk to colleagues (lexicon). But even more it is learning different paradigms. Took a long time for her to internalize and find terms to speak about what these methodologies were. First 6 years. Feeling like she got another doctorate.

14:36 Talking about identity in two different ways? Psychologist and computer scientist. Talks about meeting with Bob Kraut and he said he has never felt more like a psychologist. But she feels like an HCI person, a CS person. But she also asks different questions. Goes back to training. “I have a toolkit, I have a way of understanding the world. And then I apply this toolkit to these problems (that) are very different to what I would have encountered as a psychologist.” And she has augmented her toolkit over the last decade.

16:55 Had she thought about her skillset as a toolkit before? No, it’s like when a fish in water, what do you know. Only when she came to CS that she was forced to understand what she brings to the table. She is all about requirements gathering/needs assessment but had to learn that these were the terms to use.

19:00 She talks more about the difference between CS and psychology. In psychology, defining things is important. But it seemed to be more taken for granted in CS/HCI. In CS/HCI we talk of the ‘user’ but the only user she had heard of before was a drug user – a weird term to use. And then reading monographs like Yvonne Roger’s on theory that made sense. “Serves a purpose to have a definite understanding of what it is we mean.” And for working with different disciplines – and what the expectations are, what CS does eg not going to build instagram for X. Back to the practice of articulating what we do so we’re clear about what is a deliverable.

24:10 Practical things that helped getting into CS/HCI? What it means to do a dissertation – how many papers have you read. So had to immerse herself and read the papers and working with grad students to provide references for terms eg cognitive walkthrough, contextual enquiry. Had to find a lot of structure. Could also ask Gregory. Risky but has a good temperament and doesn’t mind asking and being vulnerable. Authenticity is important. Were times that the reception wasn’t positive but had much more to gain than lose at this point. Comes back to wanting to be a member of the community, to values. Believed that CS can really help support the betterment of mankind. How could I not fight this fight, “my little app that could make kids better”.

29:00 Finding her why? It is a powerful thing to feel like you could change the world, could make things better. And if that’s what you can do it is worth it.

29:30 Mentoring relationship with Gregory? Informal, gracious, direct. Respected her intellect and feedback. Tells of an ‘alpha male’ experience and giving feedback that it was inappropriate. A decade working together, changes over time. Have different values but ok – “I have become my own person”. ‘Become’ a verb, we are changing and a good thing.

32:40 Working in same college as husband? In different areas. No issues that they came up with. Others might have had some comments. But she shows she is a good colleague, has something to offer (stats, quant eval). There were times she tried to sign up for things but told she couldn’t as it was for academic not research faculty.

35:00 Describes her research faculty position. She also does teaching. Says ‘why not’ when told she can’t do something and asks for the policy on this. Doesn’t take no for an answer just because.  Got into some of those roles. Now the assoc chair of graduate studies, from a research position. Nominated by colleagues. They could see she did care. Able to work out a situation where funding comes from different streams. Doing this for 10 years in research position. Only thing in being an academic position is being a professor. Can’t be called prof. Ok with this. “I get to do all the things I now love so I am happy.”

38:10: Chair of graduate affairs work? Says ‘those who can do, and those who care become administrators’. I do care. Had an incredible graduate experience at Harvard where they cared about the whole person eg creative outlets, learnt to row, play frisbee. ‘We know you are going to do great work if you can say sane so here are some ways of staying sane’. Sets the tone that it is ok to be a whole person, need to be doing these things. So she sends out emails to grad students and reminds them about their whole self and need to actively engage other parts of their life. What does it mean to be a grad student, to develop a toolkit, how do we make it clear to students what it means to be doing well and the department are behind them? Grad students weren’t on the org chart.

42:00 We have policies that will work for them. Importance of clearly articulating what milestones are and what it means to progress through these milestones and what it means for people to be successful. It’s not failure, it’s feedback. How do we give you the feedback that you are doing well or that this is not the right place for you and that is fine too. Reminds grad students of responsibilities, milestones, and things like meeting regularly with supervisor, documenting work etc. And where to go to when things are not working out.

45:00 Send out emails. Met with all incoming interactive computing students. Have a student appreciation, lunch, puts milestones up to make them visible. That’s my role, to keep the trains moving, the signposts up, and remind people of rights and responsibilities and that includes faculty.

46:35 Onboarding new faculty? At a retreat. Started from the beginning to remind everyone of things coming up that need their attention. The reminder in chief. My pleasure, this is my role. Here’s what it means for us to all be on the same page. Have two-yearly PhD reviews. In the calendar. Reminders re the structure.

49:10 Reminding re whole self? Give them permission. Had a lot of students come back and say that was so nice to get permission to be whole person. We set the tone. Mental health and students is so important. Emails - what are you going to do to stay healthy in mind and body? First onboarding of all grad students. Used to do it in separate areas. This was the first year everyone came together. First think I said was welcome. Second was you belong here.

53:10 Literary magazine article on female faculty and dearth and statistics. Back to a set of values and way of moving forward. How do we systematically provide a structure for women to have their place, eg that they don’t do more service, don’t cite themselves? How to make service in the lab more transparent and accountable? Who will make up the sheet? She decided to do this, to model this behavior. Best practices, we can quantitatively evaluate them to see if things are getting better. Need to be reminded that we’re not doing as well as we think.

58:30 Now is the time where she can think about these issues as an administrator. Plans coming up? Putting in structures so people know where they are in the academic year. Eg qualifying exams timeline and what’s expected so it is fair. Fairness is a big value for her.  Lucky because she can speak up. And becomes a model for speaking up. Role-modelling.

1:03 Family while both working full time? Article talks about men vs women in relationships. Men say no my career first so the woman does second best. Statistics are that females will take a back seat. No wrong or right. A set of values that you have and have to do what is right for you.

1:05:10 Later phase in life? Plans to retire in India. Have a radio show where we talk to interesting academics in the town about their research. Husband as native language sidekick. J An issue about what we do for last 20 years. And the moral responsibility re training PhD students and what jobs they can go to.

1:08:12 Works in the mHealth space, patient engagement and continuity of care. Will give links.

1:09:52 End

Related Links

Researchgate: https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Rosa_Arriaga/publications

Linked in: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rosa-i-arriaga-19aa44143/

New NSF grant to improve treatment for PTSD patients:

Write up: https://www.ic.gatech.edu/news/627023/new-12-million-nsf-grant-aims-improve-treatment-ptsd-patients

Podcast:https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-interaction-hour/id1435564422

People:

Gregory Abowd - http://ubicomp.cc.gatech.edu/gregory-d-abowd/

Robert (Bob) Kraut - https://hcii.cmu.edu/people/robert-kraut

Papers/articles:

ReplicCHI award paper: A text message a day keeps the pulmonologist away.

Yvonne Rogers, 2012, HCI Theory: Classical, Modern, and Contemporary. Synthesis Lectures on Human-Centered Informatics, Morgan& Claypool.

Ann Blandford, 2019, Lessons from working with researchers and practitioners in healthcare, Interactions, Vol 26, 72-75.

Polson et al, 1992, Cognitive walkthroughs: a method for theory-based evaluation of user interfaces, IJMMS, Vol 36:5, 741-773.

Troy Vettese, Sexism in the Academy: Women’s narrowing path to tenure. N+1, Issue 34, Spring 2019.

Arriaga, R. I., and Abowd, G. D. (In Press) The Intersection of Technology and Health: Ubiquitous Computing and Human Computer Interaction Driving Behavioral Intervention Research to Address Chronic Care Management in Strategies for Team Science Success Handbook of Evidence-based Principles for Cross-Disciplinary Science and Practical Lessons Learned from Health Researchers. Hall, K. L., Vogel A. L. & Croyle, R.T. Eds.

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